09: No Strudelutions w/ hzrd149

By No Solutions April 22, 2025 · Edited April 5, 2026

“It isn’t obvious that the world had to work this way. But somehow the universe smiles on encryption.” - hzrd149 & Gigi take a stroll along the shore of cryptographic identities.

"It isn\’t obvious that the world had to work this way. But somehow the universe smiles on encryption." <a href="https://njump.me/@ye5p…knpr">hzrd149</a> & <a href="https://njump.me/@Gigi">Gigi</a> take a stroll along the shore of cryptographic identities. This dialogue explores how cryptographic signatures fundamentally shift power dynamics in social networks, moving control from servers to key holders. We discuss the concept of "setting data free" through cryptographic verification, the evolving role of relays in the ecosystem, and the challenges of building trust in decentralized systems. We examine the tension between convenience and decentralization, particularly around features like private data and data synchronization. What are the philosophical foundations of building truly decentralized social networks? And how can small architectural decisions have profound implications for user autonomy and data sovereignty? Movies mentioned: <ul> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622">2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070723/">Soylent Green (1973)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075860/">Close Encounters of the Third Kind (1977)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113481/">Johnny Mnemonic (1995)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133093/">The Matrix (1999)</a></li> </ul> In this dialogue: <ul> <li>Hzrd's past conversations: Bowls With Buds <a href="https://fountain.fm/episode/E0p20TEm9KEc2oFd3kJR">316</a> & <a href="https://fountain.fm/episode/yDeWZc79tdAiIHHADWhK">361</a></li> <li>Running into a water hose</li> <li>Little difference, big effect</li> <li>Signing data moves the power to the key holders</li> <li>Self-signing data sets the data free</li> <li>Relay specialization</li> <li>Victor's Amethyst relay guide</li> <li>Encryption and decryption is expensive - is it worth it?\ </li> <li>The magic of nostr is that stuff follows you around\ </li> <li>What should be shown? What should be hidden?\ </li> <li>Don't lie to users. Never show outdated data.\ </li> <li>Nostr is raw and immediate\ </li> <li>How quickly you get used to things working\ </li> <li>Legacy web always tries to sell you something\ </li> <li>Lying, lag, frustration\ </li> <li>How <a href="https://nostrudel.ninja/">NoStrudel</a> grew\ </li> <li>NoStrudel notifications</li> <li>Data visualization and dashboards\ </li> <li>Building in public and discussing in public\ </li> <li>Should we remove DMs?\ </li> <li>Nostr as a substrate for lookups\ </li> <li>Using nostr to exchange Signal or SimpleX credentials\ </li> <li>How private is a group chat?\ </li> <li>Is a 500-people group chat ever private?\ </li> <li>Pragmatism vs the engineering mindset\ </li> <li>The beauty and simplicity of nostr\ </li> <li>Anti-patterns in nostr\ </li> <li>Community servers and private relays\ </li> <li>Will vibe coding fix (some of the) things?\ </li> <li>Small specialized components VS frameworks\ </li> <li>Technology vs chairs (and cars, and tractors, and books)\ </li> <li>The problem of being greedy\ </li> <li>Competitive silos VS synergistic cooperation\ </li> <li>Making things easy vs barriers of entry\ </li> <li>Value4value for music and other artists\ </li> <li>Adding code vs removing code\ </li> <li>Pablo's <a href="https://github.com/jodobear/sparcaroo">Roo setup</a> and <a href="https://dvmcp.fun/">DVMCP</a>\ </li> <li>Platform permission slips vs cryptographic identities\ </li> <li>Micropayments vs Subscription Hell\ </li> <li><a href="https://ppq.ai/">PayPerQ</a>\ </li> <li>Setting our user-generated data free</li> <li>The GNU/Linux approach and how it beat Microsoft\ </li> <li>Agents learning automatically thanks to snippets published on nostr</li> <li>Taxi drivers, GPS, and outsourcing understanding</li> <li>Wizards VS vibe coders</li> <li>Age differences, Siri, and Dragon Naturally Speaking</li> <li>LLMs as a human interface to call tools</li> <li>Natural language vs math and computer language</li> <li>Natural language has to be fuzzy, because the world is fuzzy</li> <li>Language and concepts as compression</li> <li>Hzrd watching The Matrix (1999) for the first time</li> <li>Soylent Green, 2001, Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind, Johnny Mnemonic</li> <li>Are there coincidences?</li> <li>Why are LLMs rising at the same time that cryptography identities are rising?</li> <li><a href="https://21lessons.com/15/">"The universe smiles at encryption"</a></li> <li>The universe does not smile upon closed silos</li> <li>The cost of applying force from the outside</li> <li>Perfect copies, <a href="https://21lessons.com/3/">locality</a>, and the concept of "the original"\ </li> <li>Perfect memory would be a curse, not a blessing\ </li> <li>Organic forgetting VS centralized forgetting\ </li> <li>Forgetting and dying needs to be effortless\ </li> <li>(it wasn't for IPFS, and they also launched a shitcoin)\ </li> <li>Bitcoin makes is cheap to figure out what to dismiss\ </li> <li>Would you like to have a 2nd brain?\ </li> <li>Trust and running LLMs locally\ </li> <li>No need for API keys</li> <li>Adjacent communities: local-first, makers and hackers, etc.</li> <li><a href="https://njump.me/nevent1qqsxvahg4a2l6jtv5da9jycx9q0g6rjrtsgpzgj47grv7ct47yr59xgzyphydppzm7m554ecwq4gsgaek2qk32atse2l4t9ks57dpms4mmhfxjpnn59">Removing the character limit was a mistake</a></li> <li>Browsing mode vs reading mode</li> <li>The genius of <a href="https://njump.me/nevent1qqsxvahg4a2l6jtv5da9jycx9q0g6rjrtsgpzgj47grv7ct47yr59xgzyphydppzm7m554ecwq4gsgaek2qk32atse2l4t9ks57dpms4mmhfxjpnn59">tweets and threads</a></li> <li>Vibe-coding and <a href="https://github.com/justinmoon/rust-multiplatform">rust-multiplatform</a></li> <li>Global solutions vs local solutions</li> <li>The long-term survivability of local-first</li> <li>All servers will eventually go away. Your private key won't.</li> <li>It's normal to pay your <a href="https://btcmap.org/map#11/32.73046/-16.94523">breakfast with sats</a> now</li> <li>Nostr is also a normal thing now, at least for us</li> <li>Hzrd's <a href="https://github.com/hzrd149/bakery">bakery</a></li> <li>"Send Gigi a DM that says GM" - and it just works</li> <li>The user is still in control, thanks to <a href="https://github.com/greenart7c3/Amber">Amber</a></li> <li>We are lacking in nostr signing solutions</li> <li><a href="https://getalby.com/products/browser-extension">Alby</a>'s permission system as a step in the right direction</li> <li>We have to get better at explaining that stuff</li> <li>What we do, why we care, why we think it's important\ </li> </ul> Recorded at <a href="https://mempool.space/block/891754">891,754</a>. <itunes:subtitle>#09: No Strudelutions w/ hzrd149</itunes:subtitle> <itunes:duration>6905</itunes:duration> <link>https://njump.me/nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzpx77gg2frul26xkzr0gaq9n842u50axpcjhdsa3yeu388vrv5pftqys8wumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytn9d9h82mny0fmkzmn6d9njuumsv93k2tcppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qqs807qeg24nhkjq6s2pjfeua23praq35cquqnhguxw9vfuqcc2ctrsau3uaz</link> <pubDate>Fri, 18 Apr 2025 16:04:11 +0000</pubDate> <author>Gigi</author> <itunes:author>Gigi</itunes:author> <itunes:explicit>No</itunes:explicit> <itunes:keywords>nostr, development, sovereign engineering, shipping, memes, web, internet, conversation, dialog</itunes:keywords> <itunes:summary><![CDATA["It isn\’t obvious that the world had to work this way. But somehow the universe smiles on encryption." <a href="https://njump.me/@ye5p…knpr">hzrd149</a> & <a href="https://njump.me/@Gigi">Gigi</a> take a stroll along the shore of cryptographic identities. This dialogue explores how cryptographic signatures fundamentally shift power dynamics in social networks, moving control from servers to key holders. We discuss the concept of "setting data free" through cryptographic verification, the evolving role of relays in the ecosystem, and the challenges of building trust in decentralized systems. We examine the tension between convenience and decentralization, particularly around features like private data and data synchronization. What are the philosophical foundations of building truly decentralized social networks? And how can small architectural decisions have profound implications for user autonomy and data sovereignty? Movies mentioned: <ul> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622">2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070723/">Soylent Green (1973)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075860/">Close Encounters of the Third Kind (1977)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113481/">Johnny Mnemonic (1995)</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133093/">The Matrix (1999)</a></li> </ul> In this dialogue: <ul> <li>Hzrd's past conversations: Bowls With Buds <a href="https://fountain.fm/episode/E0p20TEm9KEc2oFd3kJR">316</a> & <a href="https://fountain.fm/episode/yDeWZc79tdAiIHHADWhK">361</a></li> <li>Running into a water hose</li> <li>Little difference, big effect</li> <li>Signing data moves the power to the key holders</li> <li>Self-signing data sets the data free</li> <li>Relay specialization</li> <li>Victor's Amethyst relay guide</li> <li>Encryption and decryption is expensive - is it worth it?\ </li> <li>The magic of nostr is that stuff follows you around\ </li> <li>What should be shown? What should be hidden?\ </li> <li>Don't lie to users. Never show outdated data.\ </li> <li>Nostr is raw and immediate\ </li> <li>How quickly you get used to things working\ </li> <li>Legacy web always tries to sell you something\ </li> <li>Lying, lag, frustration\ </li> <li>How <a href="https://nostrudel.ninja/">NoStrudel</a> grew\ </li> <li>NoStrudel notifications</li> <li>Data visualization and dashboards\ </li> <li>Building in public and discussing in public\ </li> <li>Should we remove DMs?\ </li> <li>Nostr as a substrate for lookups\ </li> <li>Using nostr to exchange Signal or SimpleX credentials\ </li> <li>How private is a group chat?\ </li> <li>Is a 500-people group chat ever private?\ </li> <li>Pragmatism vs the engineering mindset\ </li> <li>The beauty and simplicity of nostr\ </li> <li>Anti-patterns in nostr\ </li> <li>Community servers and private relays\ </li> <li>Will vibe coding fix (some of the) things?\ </li> <li>Small specialized components VS frameworks\ </li> <li>Technology vs chairs (and cars, and tractors, and books)\ </li> <li>The problem of being greedy\ </li> <li>Competitive silos VS synergistic cooperation\ </li> <li>Making things easy vs barriers of entry\ </li> <li>Value4value for music and other artists\ </li> <li>Adding code vs removing code\ </li> <li>Pablo's <a href="https://github.com/jodobear/sparcaroo">Roo setup</a> and <a href="https://dvmcp.fun/">DVMCP</a>\ </li> <li>Platform permission slips vs cryptographic identities\ </li> <li>Micropayments vs Subscription Hell\ </li> <li><a href="https://ppq.ai/">PayPerQ</a>\ </li> <li>Setting our user-generated data free</li> <li>The GNU/Linux approach and how it beat Microsoft\ </li> <li>Agents learning automatically thanks to snippets published on nostr</li> <li>Taxi drivers, GPS, and outsourcing understanding</li> <li>Wizards VS vibe coders</li> <li>Age differences, Siri, and Dragon Naturally Speaking</li> <li>LLMs as a human interface to call tools</li> <li>Natural language vs math and computer language</li> <li>Natural language has to be fuzzy, because the world is fuzzy</li> <li>Language and concepts as compression</li> <li>Hzrd watching The Matrix (1999) for the first time</li> <li>Soylent Green, 2001, Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind, Johnny Mnemonic</li> <li>Are there coincidences?</li> <li>Why are LLMs rising at the same time that cryptography identities are rising?</li> <li><a href="https://21lessons.com/15/">"The universe smiles at encryption"</a></li> <li>The universe does not smile upon closed silos</li> <li>The cost of applying force from the outside</li> <li>Perfect copies, <a href="https://21lessons.com/3/">locality</a>, and the concept of "the original"\ </li> <li>Perfect memory would be a curse, not a blessing\ </li> <li>Organic forgetting VS centralized forgetting\ </li> <li>Forgetting and dying needs to be effortless\ </li> <li>(it wasn't for IPFS, and they also launched a shitcoin)\ </li> <li>Bitcoin makes is cheap to figure out what to dismiss\ </li> <li>Would you like to have a 2nd brain?\ </li> <li>Trust and running LLMs locally\ </li> <li>No need for API keys</li> <li>Adjacent communities: local-first, makers and hackers, etc.</li> <li><a href="https://njump.me/nevent1qqsxvahg4a2l6jtv5da9jycx9q0g6rjrtsgpzgj47grv7ct47yr59xgzyphydppzm7m554ecwq4gsgaek2qk32atse2l4t9ks57dpms4mmhfxjpnn59">Removing the character limit was a mistake</a></li> <li>Browsing mode vs reading mode</li> <li>The genius of <a href="https://njump.me/nevent1qqsxvahg4a2l6jtv5da9jycx9q0g6rjrtsgpzgj47grv7ct47yr59xgzyphydppzm7m554ecwq4gsgaek2qk32atse2l4t9ks57dpms4mmhfxjpnn59">tweets and threads</a></li> <li>Vibe-coding and <a href="https://github.com/justinmoon/rust-multiplatform">rust-multiplatform</a></li> <li>Global solutions vs local solutions</li> <li>The long-term survivability of local-first</li> <li>All servers will eventually go away. Your private key won't.</li> <li>It's normal to pay your <a href="https://btcmap.org/map#11/32.73046/-16.94523">breakfast with sats</a> now</li> <li>Nostr is also a normal thing now, at least for us</li> <li>Hzrd's <a href="https://github.com/hzrd149/bakery">bakery</a></li> <li>"Send Gigi a DM that says GM" - and it just works</li> <li>The user is still in control, thanks to <a href="https://github.com/greenart7c3/Amber">Amber</a></li> <li>We are lacking in nostr signing solutions</li> <li><a href="https://getalby.com/products/browser-extension">Alby</a>'s permission system as a step in the right direction</li> <li>We have to get better at explaining that stuff</li> <li>What we do, why we care, why we think it's important\ </li> </ul>

#08: Navigating the Vibe w/ Pablo

"With the shift towards this multi-agent collaboration and orchestration world, you need a neutral substrate that has money, identity, cryptography, and web-of-trust\ baked in, to make everything work." <a href="https://njump.me/@PABLOF7z">Pablo</a> & <a href="https://njump.me/@Gigi">Gigi</a> are getting high on glue nostr. \ Books and articles mentioned: <ul> <li><a href="https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/36656180-saving-beauty">Saving beauty</a> by Byung-Chul Han</li> <li><a href="https://wattenberger.com/thoughts/llms-as-a-tool-for-thought">LLMs as a tool for thought</a> by Amelia Wattenberger</li> </ul> In this dialogue: <ul> <li><a href="https://github.com/dergigi/vibeline">vibeline</a> & <a href="https://github.com/dergigi/vibeline-ui">vibeline-ui</a></li> <li>LLMs as tools, and how to use them</li> <li>Vervaeke: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-_RdKiDbz4">AI thresholds & the path we must take</a></li> <li>Hallucinations and grounding in reality</li> <li>GPL, LLMs, and <a href="https://danb.me/blog/llms-licensing/">open-source licensing</a></li> <li>Pablo's multi-agent Roo setup</li> <li>Are we going to make programmers obsolete?</li> <li>"When it works it's amazing"</li> <li>Hiring & training agents</li> <li>Agents creating RAG databases of NIPs</li> <li>Different models and their context windows</li> <li>Generalists vs specialists</li> <li>"Write drunk, edit sober"</li> <li><a href="https://dvmcp.fun/">DVMCP.fun</a></li> <li>Recklessness and destruction of vibe-coding\ </li> <li>Sharing secrets with agents & LLMs\ </li> <li>The "no API key" advantage of nostr</li> <li>What data to trust? And how does nostr help?\ </li> <li>Identity, web of trust, and signing data\ </li> <li>How to fight <a href="https://nostr.band/?q=%23aislop">AI slop</a></li> <li>Marketplaces of code snippets\ </li> <li>Restricting agents with expert knowledge\ </li> <li>Trusted sources without a central repository\ </li> <li><a href="https://zapstore.dev/">Zapstore</a> as the prime example\ </li> <li>"How do you fight off re-inventing GitHub?"\ </li> <li>Using large context windows to help with refactoring\ </li> <li>Code snippets for <a href="https://olas.app/">Olas</a>, <a href="https://github.com/nostr-dev-kit/ndk">NDK</a>, NIP-60, and more</li> <li>Using MCP as the base\ </li> <li>Using nostr as the underlying substrate\ </li> <li>Nostr as the glue & the discovery layer\ </li> <li>Why is this important?\ </li> <li>Why is this exciting?\ </li> <li>"With the shift towards this multi-agent collaboration and orchestration world, you need a neutral substrate that has money/identity/cryptography and web-of-trust\ baked in, to make everything work."</li> <li>How to single-shot nostr applications\ </li> <li>"Go and create this app"\ </li> <li>The agent has money, because of <a href="https://nips.nostr.com/60">NIP-60</a>/<a href="https://nips.nostr.com/61">61</a></li> <li><a href="https://ppq.ai/">PayPerQ</a>\ </li> <li>Anthropic and the genius of <a href="https://modelcontextprotocol.io/docs/concepts/tools">mcp-tools</a>\ </li> <li>Agents zapping & giving SkyNet more money\ </li> <li>Are we going to run the mints?\ </li> <li>Are agents going to run the mints?\ </li> <li>How can we best explain this to our bubble?\ </li> <li>Let alone to people outside of our bubble?\ </li> <li>Building pipelines of multiple agents\ </li> <li>LLM chains & piped Unix tools\ </li> <li>OpenAI vs Anthropic\ </li> <li>Genius models without tools vs midwit models with tools\ </li> <li>Re-thinking software development\ </li> <li>LLMs allow you to tackle bigger problems\ </li> <li>Increased speed is a paradigm shift\ </li> <li>Generalists vs specialists, left brain vs right brain\ </li> <li>Nostr as the home for specialists\ </li> <li>fiatjaf publishing snippets (reluctantly)\ </li> <li>fiatjaf's <a href="https://github.com/fiatjaf/blossom">blossom</a> implementation\ </li> <li>Thinking with LLMs</li> <li>The tension of specialization VS generalization\ </li> <li>How the publishing world changed</li> <li>Stupid faces on YouTube thumbnails\ </li> <li>Gaming the algorithm\ </li> <li>Will AI slop destroy the attention economy?\ </li> <li>Recency bias & hiding publication dates\ </li> <li>Undoing platform conditioning as a success metric\ </li> <li>Craving realness in a fake attention world\ </li> <li>The theater of the attention economy\ </li> <li>What TikTok got "right"\ </li> <li>Porn, FoodPorn, EarthPorn, etc.\ </li> <li>Porn vs Beauty\ </li> <li>Smoothness and awe\ </li> <li>"Beauty is an angel that could kill you in an instant (but decides not to)."</li> <li>The success of Joe Rogan & long-form conversations\ </li> <li>Smoothness fatigue & how our feeds numb us\ </li> <li>Nostr & touching grass\ </li> <li>How movement changes conversations\ </li> <li>LangChain & DVMs\ </li> <li>Central models vs marketplaces\ </li> <li>Going from assembly to high-level to conceptual\ </li> <li>Natural language VS programming languages\ </li> <li>Pablo's code snippets\ </li> <li>Writing documentation for LLMs</li> <li>Shared concepts, shared language, and forks\ </li> <li>Vibe-forking open-source software\ </li> <li>Spotting vibe-coded interfaces\ </li> <li>Visualizing nostr data in a 3D world\ </li> <li>Tweets, blog posts, and podcasts\ </li> <li>Vibe-producing blog posts from conversations\ </li> <li>Tweets are excellent for discovery\ </li> <li>Adding context to tweets (long-form posts, podcasts, etc)\ </li> <li>Removing the character limit was a mistake\ </li> <li>"Everyone's attention span is rekt"</li> <li>"There is no meaning without friction"\ </li> <li>"Nothing worth having ever comes easy"\ </li> <li>Being okay with doing the hard thing</li> <li>Growth hacks & engagement bait</li> <li>TikTok, theater, and showing faces and emotions</li> <li>The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1%25_rule">1% rule</a>: 99% of internet users are Lurkers</li> <li>"We are socially malnourished"</li> <li><a href="https://vertexlab.io/">Web-of-trust</a> and zaps bring realness</li> <li>The semantic web does NOT fix this LLMs might</li> <li>"You can not model the world perfectly"</li> <li>Hallucination as a requirement for creativity</li> </ul> Recorded at <a href="https://mempool.space/block/890848">890,848</a>.

Recorded at 891,754.

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